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View Full Version : I witnessed a major live gig get destroyed...


Comte de St Germain
February 2nd, 2007, 10:30 PM
Imagine you are taking your 12 year old daughter and her friend to a sold out (theater) gig by a MAJOR FOTM pop band and a slightly experimental opener. The show sold out in 30 minutes and you luckily score some "industry tix" so you can go and not be the evil dumbass dad.

I mix in this room (1100 seat theater) several times a year for nationals (openers) or for internationals during the music festival. It's a tough room but nothing too crazy for the second timer. The house system is adequate, usually the LCR is out of whack a bit and some jackleg has jacked the digital eqs to oblivion but it's workable. New breed Soundcraft console and a surround system which sucks donkey sausage.

3pm- I head down to the theater to pick up my comp tix and head into the big room during soundcheck, say hi to the house guy, the production company rep and the FOH guy for the headliner. The FOH guy is a total ass. I sit back, shoot the shit with my buds and watch him as he walks the room with his tablet tweaking HIS SYSTEM that he brought in. As the white noise makes its way around the boxes i notice something in the stage left array. I tactfully mention it to the house guy and he asks the dude to back up to that side. The guy gives him the finger basically. It sounded as though sub frequencies were being fed through all off the boxes and i was smelling a thermal interuption in the making.

I decide it's prolly a good time to leave, say good bye to the gang and jokingly wish the FOH guy good luck with 250 and 1.6k. He says something rude and I go on my way.

I've done this room, I know the problems with it, the hint was given directly and in the form of a good natured joke. The Ohio State fan shoulda caught on. At least that's what we'd hope. FYI the room usually shoots out (Smaart, SIM or whatever) with a very lively 240-250 region with corresponding octaves joining in. If the SIM system says drop 2db during the analysis and you hit the eq with it you're only part of the way there. Once people enter in, all hell breaks loose, the stage is so resonant lows are creeping up mic stands and are everywhere then there is the curtain. Did i mention they dropped a digital yamaha on top of the Soundcraft? Nevermind...

The stage was rung out with the curtain down. Guess what? The lighting guy wanted the "awesome brick wall" as part of the deal so the curtain was raised and the invitation was sent.

Showtime.


Opening act plays, rocks the house with great tunes, presence, antics and noisy improv sections. the art students eat it up, the 13 year old girls enjoy it but stay seated. System works flawlessly although the stage left side seems muddy and undefined. This is the kind of band that invites chaos, yet their dude holds down the fort without a squeel...

Flavor of the month hits the stage, piano is grating and thumps from stage left immediately, the first word of the vocal instantly turns into a 250hz accapella tune. 1.6k gets the invitation from the brick wall and starts competing with 250hz for airtime. Several songs later the IEMs are pulled from ears, band members all look lost, puzzled, disoriented and are just looking at one another aghast and attempting to laugh it off.

This goes on throughout the entire set all of the way through the encore, I can't help but wonder what the fuck this guy was on, but it wasn't "point." Did i mention that the stage left array shut down completely 10 times during the 90 minute set?

The daughter and her friend loved it.

The show, not the difficulty.

On the way out, the production company guy and the house guy came up to me and snidely asked what I thought of the show and i said: "it was a wild ride." The door was opened and all three of us shared our thoughts on how the FOH guy was too cool to take the advice of folks who knew the room.

I imagine he is looking for a new gig.

#1 worst sound of 2007 is gonna be tough to beat.

Then again I'll be mixing there again in March.

pounce
February 2nd, 2007, 11:26 PM
there's a place close to me that sounds just like that, same capacity, soundcraft board, OSU fans and all. hhm.

i've never mixed there though, but i have two friends who have. it's a little brutal.

jeez, i'd think that even an experienced guy would be happy to be told about any room quirks so as to make his gig go as smoothly as possible. lord knows i'll take any help anyone wants to give me.

CaptainHook
February 2nd, 2007, 11:48 PM
Not to try 'stir' things.. but this band..
Do they get 'scared' when at 'dances'...?

If it's the same band.. similar situation when they came here.
Maybe the soundguy likes rolling in mud.
Cause that's just about all i could hear.
But the arrangements weren't really helping him..
Sounded like all the strings/piano/guitars AND vocals were
in the same register so it got out of hand very quickly
in certain parts of the songs where frequency build up
got ridiculous.

Comte de St Germain
February 3rd, 2007, 04:57 AM
I don't know the names to the songs. They have a lead vox/piano man and sometimes the RTM guitarist sings.

Their name is akin to ripped jeans.

Anyhoo, this fucker shoulda been fired, the damn vocal mic was wailing through the entire solo piano/vox tune in the encore.

When i mix there the high pass gets rolled up to as high as I can stand it and dumped the full amount. I have a feeling he was too lazy to mess with his digital PM4000d.

The guy who mixed the opening band was spot on, same board, i imagine the same FOH eq and all.

rockdart
February 3rd, 2007, 06:55 AM
Kinda-but-not-really related, there's a place in St. Cloud MN that has the most effed up maze to bring the snake through - the club knew the route and if you were smart, you asked 'em and if you weren't a dick, they'd tell you.

I heard of some bands going through there that it took an hour or more to run it through.

I listened to several sound guys that came through my stomping grounds while we were telling stories back and forth - they gave me the heads ups and I was through in 15 minutes with 3 snakes (1 sound, 2 light) bundled together.

One has to wonder how anyone can hear a room when they can't listen.

It's always seemed to me that the more I learn, the less I know. And the learning can be as fun as the doing. It amazes me when people can be so closed.

CaptainHook
February 3rd, 2007, 10:32 AM
Their name is akin to ripped jeans.


Different band.
A shame this kinda thing happens..

Although, the 'big name' band i'm talking about, took 3 hours to soundcheck.
Most of it was a rehearsal as they tried to remember how
to play their songs.

Maybe the sound guy did an amazing job to make them
sound even that good. :Wink:

Comte de St Germain
February 3rd, 2007, 08:31 PM
Yeah, I'm always relying on the house guy to fill me in on the particulars of a room, especially since I don't do the live thing that often.

The thing is the house system woulda worked fine with a couple extra subs. He just wanted to mark his spot, walk around with the tablet and from what I gather, pretend to shoot the room.

He had all the tools but damn if he didn't screw the pooch worse than anyone I've ever heard.

Jason Phair
February 3rd, 2007, 11:28 PM
I have a feeling he was too lazy to mess with his digital PM4000d.



Are you sure it wasn't the PM7D? :lol:

Comte de St Germain
February 4th, 2007, 05:45 PM
Are you sure it wasn't the PM7D? :lol:

Heh. He had a notebook over the logo, but it was the little one.

I don't use digital boards.

bunnerabb
February 5th, 2007, 06:58 AM
I've been to gigs like that.

I'm just sort of waver somewhere between "IF YOU DO NOT DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS SHIT, I WILL FUCKING KILL YOU WITH MY TEETH!"

and

"*sn0rt*"

I usually just leave.

Brendo
February 12th, 2007, 02:41 AM
Not to try 'stir' things.. but this band..
Do they get 'scared' when at 'dances'...?

Do you mean... Scared! At the Dances...? But I understand, at their shows, nobody closes the goddamn door... to allow for the audience to escape quickly.

CaptainHook
February 12th, 2007, 09:47 AM
Brendo ~ yes i do. I get the feeling that every support band
that plays with them will show them up. :Razz:

ggunn
February 12th, 2007, 09:18 PM
Brendo ~ yes i do. I get the feeling that every support band
that plays with them will show them up. :Razz:

It happens. Way back when ('73, maybe?), I saw Kansas open for Bad Company, and Bad Co. was completely outshone. It was kinda weird - they were not touring together, but a local promoter bought dates for them both and put the gig together. Kansas came onstage about 15 minutes early, while the crowd was still coming in, and the lead singer came to the mic and hurriedly said something like "They've only given us 45 minutes to play, so we're not gonna talk we're just going to play as long as we can and there won't be an encore". Methinks Bad Company pitched some sort of fit when they saw who was opening for them. With good reason; Kansas made them look silly.

Another time, a sort of radical bluegrass rock group called Seatrain opened for Black Sabbath at a show I saw in New Orleans, and even the blackclad crowd loved them. When Sabbath dragged out the ego delay returning to the stage for their encore, the crowd began chanting "Seatrain, Seatrain, Seatrain..."

bunnerabb
February 13th, 2007, 10:58 PM
Grand Funk Railroad, a little garage band from Flint, MI, USA - got their skinny asses booted squarely off of the Led Zep tour, back in the day, after about three dates for unceremoniously blowing Lord Heavy and Co. so far off the stage they needed a Geiger counter to find them.

Energy beats pomposity, every time.

rockdart
February 13th, 2007, 11:59 PM
"can I get a witness"