Selling Outboard Gear for Plugins? Advice

[luke_m]

I think I've made up my mind to sell my outboard gear to get plugin replacements...

I've got a TLAudio FAT1 Stereo Valve Compressor, A Lexicon reverb unit, and another compressor, which I never use because connecting them all is tricky for me.

Everyone always seems to always tell me never trust plugins over analoge gear, but times must be changing because the more im hearing plugins the more im liking.

Also I recently I got the SSL Duende, (which is the most amazing sounding thing i've personally ever owned) Im digging the plugin feel of it.

I don't usually ask for advice, but I'm curious as to what you guys think about getting rid of outboard valve stuff for newer plugins... Am I selling out...

I'd appreaciate any posts, even if its just a few words, thanks alot... :Yawn:

[recall]

I keep a couple of outboard bits just to use as "spice" for a sound, but I'm 95% digital. I think the mcdsp stuff is excellent and the DUY stuff is great. I've never used the TLA but heard good things about it. If you can keep hold of it I would. If not then I'm sure you'll be good with duende and something new.

[Barish]

It depends whose music you work for.



If someone else's music will be paying for your fixed asset's wear and tear, then by all means.



But if your own music will be paying for it, then my opinion is you are wasting your money in plug-in technology. Betting on a virtual horse.


I have gear from 1960's, 1970s, 1980s, 1990s and 2000s, all plugging into the same mixing bus and working without having to pay the manufacturer for an upgrade to make them work forward/backward compatible.


Do you think that the plugins you have paid for back in 2005 will work along with some other plug-ins you will have bought in 2011 in a computer you'll have bought in 2009, without having to pay the plug-in manufacturers all over again (if they are still around by then at all)?


Think about it.


I'm not against plug-ins, and in fact, they are certainly a different line of spice next to good old Indian curry and they do amazing stuff, but I would never ever rely my whole kitchen on them.


Rememer, when you buy a plug-in, you don't own it. You are just licenced to use it.


You can't sell them, you can't trade them in if you get fed up with them, you can't mod them to your heart's content.


The insurers wouldn't insure it, the banks wouldn't remortgage it.


You are down to the dude who wrote it to do something about it so that it may do the additional things that you'd wish it did. If he didn't change his mind and go work as a chalet boy out there in a ski resort for free snowboarding once a week...


So they don't even count as a proper fixed asset.


No matter hom many updates they release, they are never fixed anyhow.


Times are changing.


Yes. That's correct.


When everybody is hypnotized and throwing themselves from a cliff, will you do that too just because it is what the times/masses dictate?

http://www.usatoday.com/news/offbeat/2005-07-08-sheep-suicide_x.htm

http://www.jwz.org/images/capt.ist80107090158.turkey_sheep_ist801.jpg

B.

[Charles Dye]

Oh boy... let me get my popcorn. BRB

[Extreme Mixing]

I guess I have a bit of a different take on this. I make money with the plug ins, so I really don't mind paying for them, when they serve me and make my work better. I have several hardware reverbs and delays out in the garage that I haven't used on a mix in YEARS! Hows that for obsolete? Really no differet than the plugs in some ways. Once I'm inside Pro Tools, I stay there, nearly exclusively.

Bottom line, get the gear that YOU will use. If it's hard to plug in, as mentioned above, it won't get used. If it's hard for you to operate, then it won't get used. Make your set up easy to get around on. Put your gear in racks with a patchbay, so you can plug it in in seconds. Don't leave yourself hunting for a cord, or trying to find a physical place to put your hardward effects. Why even have them if they're hard to use.

Creativity can be a fleeting thing. I don't want to spend much time crawling behind a rack with a flashlight while I'm mixing.

Right Charles?

Steve

[Stick]

Yep, all ITB for me too. Fast, easy, sounds the way I want it to.

McDSP, Sony, ReVibe, TL Space, and even the stock Digi plugs are pretty good. Smack, and the newer EQ3 and Dynamics3.

[Barish]

Nooo!



I'm fucking with you, man. Don't you get it?



Outboard is yesterday.



Live today.



In fact, live the future.



Don't worry if you missed it now.



There'll be something even better tomorrow.



So if you don't buy anything, you are technically ahead of everything.


Sounds cool, huh?


You'll never be outdated.


:Thumbsup:



B.




P.S: If someone didn't tell, they wouldn't know how they made the music that touched them ;)


They wouldn't care either.





P.P.S: Hey Charles, was I cool, huh?



:D

[Extreme Mixing]

Hey Brian Steckler! I think we worked together, apart on some stuff for Giorgio Moroder. It's a small web...

Steve

[Stick]

Steve:
No way! Yeah, I did a few demos with him... I don't think there was ever anything that went anywhere... did we ever meet at his place or something?

Are you in Sherman Oaks? Seems like I see you on Gearslutz too...

[slabrock]

I'd appreaciate any posts, even if its just a few words, thanks alot... :Yawn:

Well, this is a question, i've lately been giving a considerable amount of thought.

Question is a philosophcal one, and possibly deeper than you know. This is what appeared me, when i heard how good the SSL plug sounds, and when testing out the Focusrite Liquidmix: Do we need to buy anything anymore now that we have convolution impulse response ?

Maybe you should take as good IR's as ever possible of your equipment, now that you still can. Then any half-decent DAW and a free S.I.R. convolution reverb can replace anything you have.

Sorry, i'm wandering. Don't do anything hasty
:D :Uh oh: :D

Peace,

Slabrock

[Barish]

My point of view has nothing to do with sonic quality. I believe digital has caught up with analog domain in many areas today, and it is almost there in many others. It even surpassed in a few areas on top of that, as far as my current knowledge and experience goes. (Some may prove me wrong for the moment but that won't change the fact of what's in the horizon.)

The only problem I'm seeing with pro audio in software domain is that its standards are not entirely determined and ruled by the manufacturers of audio software anymore, but are rather dependent on the decisions of the decision-makers of a higher league, for whom pro audio is simply as big as a sand dune in their bigger picture.

Whereas in the hardware world, pro audio industry has and rules its own standards, which is why the compatibility has never been an an issue even among a span of 30-40 years of product life, still counting and being valid.

But it is an issue for the software domain and it will always be so with the way the digital universe is expanding around this small world of audio.

That's all.


I'm not saying I'm not using soft-tools. Of course I do.

But I'm not spending all my money on it for my own use.

B.

[Mundox]

I agree with Barish. Analog will never lose its value, even 20 years from now (as long as there are still real instruments and singers)
I'd never sell good analog outboard. Unless I'm giving it all up. Hell, I still own SPX90's. :very happy:

[luke_m]

thanks for sharing all your ideas, seriously. *hats off*

and thanks ALOT for making me even more undecided than when i posted the question in the first place.. geezzz :Yawn:

seriously though, to answer some questions, i do it for myself for the love of it, the genre is hiphop, so all the samples are coming off vinyl records... i dont have guitars to mic or things like that... and its all pretty much chopped up digitally

i was thinking of making the rule, if it doesnt get used for 6 months, sell it for something you'll use everyday...

[PSN John Davidson]

I'm actually going through the same thought process now. I'm thinking about getting rid of my lexicon, compressors, drum machines and even my DAT player. I realized that I haven't used that thing in years.....hahahah

[Shez]

Well, plugs are twilighted stuff. There are people who vibe off of the view of just seeing their 1176ers racked up in dim light in the studio. Peronally, I don't expect many people to be so nerdy as to get horny seing their Bombfactory-plugins chained up on the screen.

I'm a plug-man as well, but just because I can't afford the real stuff. :Confused:


You are down to the dude who wrote it to do something about it so that it may do the additional things that you'd wish it did. If he didn't change his mind and go work as a chalet boy out there in a ski resort for free snowboarding once a week...


May I ask who that person was? Just curious. :very happy:

Cheers,
Shez

[Charles Dye]

*crunch*

*crunch*

*crunch*

[PSN Big Al]

*crunch*

*crunch*

*crunch*

STOP it! You're killin' me. :very happy:

[EricTheKid]

*crunch*

*crunch*

*crunch*

STOP it! You're killin' me. :very happy:


Man, this guy's got some wicked creative emocations...

Any chance we could get the HULK back!!? :icon_eek:

(a personal favorite)

[EricTheKid]

Well, plugs are twilighted stuff. There are people who vibe off of the view of just seeing their 1176ers racked up in dim light in the studio. Peronally, I don't expect many people to be so nerdy as to get horny seing their Bombfactory-plugins chained up on the screen.

Personally, I don't want to be vibing with anyone getting horny about audio gear (hardware or software) in my control room... :Uh oh:

Just let me take a smoke break and I'll be back in 15...

:Thumbsup: :Cry:

[Barish]

*crunch*

*crunch*

*crunch*

http://womb.mixerman.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=1094&stc=1&d=1170970402

"- Bwaaa-ha-ha-ha-ha!!! Can't believe they're still fighting over a penny...
- Yeah but that's how the copper wire was invented honey..."

B.

[Charles Dye]

Right Charles?

*crunch*

Yesh.

*crunch*

[luke_m]

i have decided to sell everything analog and digital to buy mass amounts of popcorn, its what all the pro's seem to have...:Yawn:

[PSN Big Al]

i have decided to sell everything analog and digital to buy mass amounts of popcorn, its what all the pro's seem to have...:Yawn:

Which popcorn are you going to choose? The old analog style
that goes on the stove top, or the newer digital microwave
kind?

I've heard that you can really tell the difference just by looking
at a bucket of each. :Twisted:

[Barish]

*crunch*

Yesh.

*crunch*

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


B.

[Barish]

Which popcorn are you going to choose? The old analog style
that goes on the stove top, or the newer digital microwave
kind?

I've heard that you can really tell the difference just by looking
at a bucket of each. :Twisted:

Salty for the aggression and sweet for the fat bottom.


Plain bucket for the mastering...

B.

[PSN Big Al]

Salty for the aggression and sweet for the fat bottom.


Plain bucket for the mastering...

B.

Do you like to eyeball it, or actually use your hand for limiting
the level of the popcorn in the bucket?

Do you find that limiting the level too much makes it taste funny?

[David Aurora]

disregarding the financial side (coz frankly if being smart with money counted, none of us would own gear......)..............


its horses for courses. for your hip hop thing i wouldnt bother much with outboard. fuck it off. shit, send it to me! see im getting ready to do the opposite- fuck off this virtual shit and sink deeper in to debt buying piles of outboard shit. cause thats how i work- a billion mics routed to a billion places. i need that shit. as it stands i have an embarrassing lack of outboard and it slows me down massively.

the basic gist:
- plugins are cheaper
- analog is quicker (seriously, i can repatch a patchbay faster than setting protools inserts any day this week)....but you need the i/o
- analog holds value (to an extent) and doesnt need paid updates
- you buy one plug in and you can insert it shitloads. 10/20/30 for the price of 1.
- plug ins dont fuck out like analog. bugs can be fixed free
- you cant pop open a plug in and swap a cap to fix a bug

.....it goes on and on. straight answer- for your situation (or my understanding of it at least), you dont really need the hardware

[JFernandez]

Oh boy... let me get my popcorn. BRB

Hehehe! Thats really funny!

[bunnerabb]

If you haven't sold them by summer, PM me

I am in the process of getting fuck rid of ITB forever, oddly.

[Charles Dye]

*crunch*

heh..

*crunch*

u tell em br.

*crunch*