Stereo Questions

[lebouche]

OK.
So...
If you record a stereo pair o mics on a guitar for example. What do you get if you pan one stereo take hard left and one stereo take hard right? Dual Mono?? Or is it just pointless as you are narrowing each stereo image.
Havent got my system up this week or I would try it. Computer still in rehab.
Cheers,

[Anderson]

Depends a lot from where the mics are placed (distance etc) the room (size, RT etc) and where the instrument is in the room (close to a wall or dead center or...)

You get some kind of "stereo" Auralization if panned Hard L/R, now to what extent it *works* depends if you're using ORTF, XY, or dummy head + all the rest above.

And watch your phase carefully... :Roll eyes:

[DaveC]

the question is a bit vague, I am not sure what exactly you are asking.

Do you mean 'what happen's if you use a stereo pair to record a mono instrument?' Or are you asking 'Is an acoustic guitar a stereo instrument?'

If you set up stereo mics to record - say - a trumpet, you would get stereo ambience and hopefully an image in your stereo field of where that 'mono' instrument is. And if the trumpeter was swinging his trumpet from side to side as he played, hopefully your image of the instrument would move too.

an acoustic guitar does develop different sounds in different places, so you could record one in stereo so that you hear the body more to the left and the neck more to the right (or vice versa if a southpaw or if you want the guitarists' perspective). It can be a nice way to record a guitar in the right context, but in a busy rock mix a mono recording might work better.

[HOOK]

OK.
So...
If you record a stereo pair o mics on a guitar for example. What do you get if you pan one stereo take hard left and one stereo take hard right? Dual Mono?? Or is it just pointless as you are narrowing each stereo image.
Havent got my system up this week or I would try it. Computer still in rehab.
Cheers,

Hmmm do you mean:

A: St1L at 8 o´clock, St1R at 12 o´clock AND St2L at 12 o´clock, St2R at 4 o´clock?

Or

B: St1L&R at 8 o´clock AND St2L&R at 4 o´clock?

Or

C :Whats the diff. between Stereo and dual mono?


HOOK

[Shotgun]

OK.
So...
If you record a stereo pair o mics on a guitar for example. What do you get if you pan one stereo take hard left and one stereo take hard right? Dual Mono?? Or is it just pointless as you are narrowing each stereo image.
Havent got my system up this week or I would try it. Computer still in rehab.
Cheers,


My interpretation of what you're asking:

You've recorded a stereo acoustic guitar track and panned both sides hard left. Then, you recorded a stereo acoustic guitar track and panned both sides hard right. Right?

So what you've really got is two mono tracks panned left/right. The tracks themselves are no longer truly stereo. What you may notice in doing this, depending on your mic placement, is some phase cancellation/comb filtering type voodoo going on in each track. What you'd gain by doing this, I have no idea--except practice placing stereo mics and collapsing them to mono.

~S

[lebouche]

My interpretation of what you're asking:

You've recorded a stereo acoustic guitar track and panned both sides hard left. Then, you recorded a stereo acoustic guitar track and panned both sides hard right. Right?

So what you've really got is two mono tracks panned left/right. The tracks themselves are no longer truly stereo. What you may notice in doing this, depending on your mic placement, is some phase cancellation/comb filtering type voodoo going on in each track. What you'd gain by doing this, I have no idea--except practice placing stereo mics and collapsing them to mono.

~S
Exactamundo... badabing.
I was just apondering and you have answered my question. So I get two mono tracks.
Are they going to sound thicker or is the cancellation going to ruin them...

What if I go with hooks A: St1L at 8 o´clock, St1R at 12 o´clock AND St2L at 12 o´clock, St2R at 4 o´clock?
Thanks

[Shotgun]

Exactamundo... badabing.
I was just apondering and you have answered my question. So I get two mono tracks.
Are they going to sound thicker or is the cancellation going to ruin them...

What if I go with
Thanks


Well, having two identical tracks panned the same will give you +3dB level, but if they started out as a stereo pair of a single source you won't have the same material in both tracks, so you'll probably get some additive results, but probably not in a predictable manner.

If you use the other method described above, if I'm reading it right after 4 out of 48 hours sleep: I think you'll wind up with a quadraphonic-kinda thing that'll either be really in your face or a smeary mess of stereo phasing.

~S

[DaveC]

Ah thanks shot and leb, I see what the question is now.

Since this is a hypothetical question - are we to assume the guitars have not actually been recorded yet? If so, then should you see fit to record with 2 mics, use them to capture different tonalities rather than a stereo image, and make sure they compliment each other in mono. If you are recording in stereo to keep your options open, then take extra care to check the mono compatibility. This will be useful even if the guitar is used in stereo, since it might get played back on mono TVs or something (though there are fewer and fewer mono devices around these days).

If you do not have control over the recording stage, then your mixing options may be dictated by the quality of what you get.

[Brendo]

if you ask Mixerman he would tell you this:
In general, if you fill up the stereo field with stereo recordings, you only serve to muck things up. For me, I prefer mono information spread in and around the field. I get far more clarity in this manner, and to me, it's a more accurate representation of how we hear directionally.

[Carlo]

if you ask Mixerman he would tell you this:

Originally Posted by Mixerman
In general, if you fill up the stereo field with stereo recordings, you only serve to muck things up. For me, I prefer mono information spread in and around the field. I get far more clarity in this manner, and to me, it's a more accurate representation of how we hear directionally.

and to quote Mous...'WORD!'

[otek]

The word "stereo" is quite misleading in this context, because when you start panning things the same way, it technically ceases to be stereo.

So why would you do it?

Well, a mic placed behind the bridge of an acoustic guitar will sound different from one placed, say, above the 14th fret.

If you aim both those mics at the sound hole, you will have a nice stereo image of the acoustic if you pan them hard left and right. If you don't, what you'll have is the two different sounds combining. Phase problems will be much more apparent this way, and you have to watch out for the player moving around.

Generally speaking, what I would do for this kind of thing is to either a) mic in mono, or b) use two mics, one which will be panned opposite to the guitar and set up to create a little ambience. I would then move the mics and adjust the gain until when the mics are panned hard L+R, I have a natural stereo image with the guitar panned one way. I then mirror image the setup for the overdub.

This whole thing naturally hinges on the density of the track, if you have a lot of stuff going on, maybe it's best to go mono. The good thing with technique B is, if you decide you want mono later, you just scrap the "ambient" side.


otek