Cool or cheesy - please help me decide...

[Dubnick]

Hey guys - this is only the second time I've posted a mix up here for critique, so I'm hoping the feedback will continue to be helpful and not too harsh, but I'll brace myself for the worst just in case - hahaha.

Anyhow, here's the deal, at the 54 second mark of this track I decided, at the last minute, to try a mute-everything-but-the-squashed-talkback-mic-of-the-drum-mix trick to sort of thing to mix it up a bit and to make the transitional drumfill stand out more. I did one version with the effect with it in, and one without, and I can't decide whether it's sounds cheesy and distracting or kinda cool and surprising (I'm currently leaning towards the former). Anyhow, I'd love to get some feedback on that aspect in the context of the track and the overall mix in general. I've already got some feedback on the mix from a couple engineers I really trust, one of whom I consider a bit of a mentor, and they both independently pointed out something about the overall mix and I'm also curious to see how many folks here hear the same thing cause I'm a bit wary of going back into the mix and tweaking this particular aspect (sorry to be vague), but if enough people say something about it, I'm more likely to give it a couple more passes before I call it done.

Also, I asked the band's permission to post the mix here, since they haven't let anyone hear it yet (please do not share the files or pass the link on to anyone) and they were totally cool with it but wanted me to ask you guys to critique the song too.

Here's the rundown on the track:
Title: How To Catch A Serial Crusher
Band: Letterday
Written By Letterday, with additional lyrics by, well, me (I'm not in the band, I just produce them).

Notes:
- The first version has the talkback effect in question at the 54 second mark, while the second version does not.
- I psuedo-mastered the mixes, and while I always try to keep any adverse effect of my lack of mastering skills as inaudible as possible (only eqing was rolling of any subs and the highest of highs), if it's your inhibiting analysis of the mix, let me know and I'll post the straight mixes.
- We are planning on cutting a large portion of the bridge as the track is long and that part gets redundant.

Thanks for listening and for any feedback, positive or negative. Also, thanks in advance for not spreading the track around - it's posted here for the sole purpose of critique by you guys:)

[crunch]

Hi Dubnick!
I kinda like the song. I'm sometimes a sucker for fast power pop/punk songs with a melody. For me though, the song was over at 2:43; imho, I would cut the song at the dun-dun-dun - meeeee!

The TB part is a nice break.

Did you use an L2 or something on this? It's really smashed. I bet the "nonmastered" ver breathes a lot more, and it seems like it's having a pretty trashy effect on the guitar around 6k... which makes it harder to "feel" the drums and bass; I can hear them in there, kit sounds good.

Best of luck!

[dim light]

Hi!

I only listen to the first mix - I think it sounds great! - hope it's ok not to give feedback on the talkback etc - the first mix sounds great - no need to listen to mix 2.

Good!

[STUDIORAT]

Hi!

I only listen to the first mix - I think it sounds great! - hope it's ok not to give feedback on the talkback etc - the first mix sounds great - no need to listen to mix 2.

Good!

I LIKE A GOOD POWER PUNK SONG AS WELL IT SEEMS OVERLY BRIGHT AND REALLY SMASHED THE DRUMS OVER ALL SOUND GOOD THE CYMBALS ARE A BIT HARSH AND THE LOWS ARE ALMOST NON EXISTENT YA MIGHT WANNA TRY GETTING THE BASS FOCUSED A BIT BUT THATS A MATTER OF TASTE
OVER ALL I LIKE IT KEEP IT UP MAN CHEERS

[Cosmic Pig]

Sounds cool... maybe if it was longer it would have more poop. Or more pronounced. In the pauses leading up to it there's a guitar in the back that sounds like it's treated the same way, maybe if that guitar was more out front it would bring the :54 part out more.

The only thing I know for sure is never be afraid of cheese.

Cos.

[Dubnick]

Thanks for all the responses so quick - I really appreciate the time and effort and feedback. So here's the deal so far:

Talked to the band and we're all in agreement that talkback mic effect has to go - I agree that if the break itself was longer, it might have worked, but it goes by so quickly that it just sounds like someone hit the wrong button for a second. I'm keeping the filter/pan effect on the guitar at the spot though - it seems subtle enough that most people won't notice it and those who do might like it - the talkback effect on the drums just pulls the listener out of the mix in a bad way. I am gonna bring up the bass guitar - it's audible throughout where it is, but I think the guitars would sit better and sound bigger if I bring up the bass just a little, and I think I have some room to move without getting into boomy territory. The brightness/cymbals thing I'm a little torn on - I actually usually go way darker when it comes to cymbals (I usually reference using that Jimmy Eat World disc with the medals on the front, which has a lot less top end than most records) but the drummer is a cymbal basher and there's just a lot of cymbal in the room - unfortunately, I love me some parallel squashed room and hate me some canned reverb, so this case is a comprimise for me. Believe it or not, had I not pulled some top end from my squashed room channel, it would be worse - I initially pulled more top end, but I felt like it was taking away from the room bloom of the drums, which is what I love about squeezing the room, and I would just end up compensating by bring up the squashed room more, defeating the purpose (I have bizarre OCD logic, but at least I know and accept this). I think I'm ok with where the cymbals are at and with the level of my squashed room (there's actually a lot less of it in there than you might think), but I might play around with it a bit before I bounce the final version - I need to listen more. Also, I did notice the kind of wierd stuff that my craptastic mastering skills is doing with the snare and guitars (probably isn't helping the brightness factor either) - I think I'm hitting the soft clipper a little too hard at the end of the chain, but I think you guys still get the overall feel of the mix - it won't have anything across the two buss when it goes out for the real deal mastering, save for low end roll of and maybe some extremely, extremely light compression on the mix buss. Anyhow, sorry for rambling and thanks for checking it out. Oh yeah, one more thing - the instrumental bridge is definately going to get cut down big time - probably down to two repeats - maybe four, but I doubt it. They really wanted to keep it in there when we were tracking, so I didn't argue since I knew that we'd either do something with it (we didn't) or in the end they'd realize that part is a lot more fun to play than to listen to (they have). Anyhow, this has been totally helpful - thanks again!

[airborne]

Good stuff. I like both versions, I guess it's a matter of taste. It's not that far forward anyway, that little squashed to fuck fill. Not enough to detract from the mix if you think it's bad anyway.. :lol:

[jimmy v]

Ok,I'm willing to prove how little I know......Sounds like a good band,nice vox,good players...I thought the cymbals were a bit bright/washy...The kit seemed ...I dunno.... not.... Overall,maybe a bit ....uhhh...generic?...I dont hear any real distinctive identity or individuality...Totally a radio song! This sounds better than anything I can do!