Mellotron

[ajcamlet]

Anyone have a source for decent samples?

[malice]

I like this.

It's not a sample CD, it's an emulator :

http://www.michenaud.com/page/produit/fiche/HGCMTRON.php


G-Media. about 150$

malice

[Comte de St Germain]

G-Media. about 150$

malice

Worth every penny.

I prefer it to the real thing (most times).

[ajcamlet]

Awesome fellas. Thats Exactly what i was looking for......

ajc

[Fulcrum]

Are you looking for a sample library to work with an existing player (i.e., Kontakt), or a standalone app (VSTi)?

I'm saving my nickels and dimes to get my claws on M-Tron (http://www.gmediamusic.com/gforce/m-tron/M-Tron.html), which I understand contains all the Mellotron sound banks (EDIT: and which I notice Malice has already posted, d'oh!), but for the time being I'm using Tapeworm (http://www.tweakbench.com/tapeworm), which has only four or five but they're the four or five you would want (strings, flute, brass, choir) and would probably associate with the instrument faster than any others. Plus, as they say, with Tapeworm you can't beat the price.

[ajcamlet]

ideally i'd be looking for something along the line of say *Ivory* or like the Native instruments *b4*. I edit in PT so RTAS is sort of the way i was looking......

[Fulcrum]

OK. Just sayin', if you happen to already have the VST-to-RTAS wrapper, Tapeworm is free to your pockets. 'Course, with M-Tron you won't need the wrapper, I think that already comes in RTAS.

[ajcamlet]

Thanks fulcrom, will check it out,,,,
:Thumbsup:

[eagan]

I'm a happy user of the M-Tron. It does, apparently, include pretty much every tape set that anybody on the planet could come up with for the Mellotron. A few of those actually suck. But that's not a serious criticism, as first, it only cost $100 (USD bought at local retail music shop), and there is a wealth of great stuff.

The one and only thing I don't like is that they made a decision that because the mellotron had a duration limit of 7 or 8 seconds, they would stick to that (and not loop anything), to preserve the original dynamic character of the mellotron sounds, including envelopes. OK, cool, except they also stuck with that for things like the Birotron library stuff (when the main feature of that machine was that it WAS a loop, so you could hold notes).

Yes, I pick nits.

But if you do want just a few sounds, and would also like to actually have smooth steady loops, you might consider also digging up the Mellosound and Nanotron VST plugins (which are also both free!). I tried Tapeworm some time ago, but eventually ditched it.

I have and use all three (M-Tron, Mellosound, Nanotron), for these reasons:

M-Tron- The wealth of various banks (but not looped)
Mellosound- Nice strings, the sounds are looped, and you have control of attack and release (but no flutes)
Nanotron- Has the flutes, the sounds are looped (but no control of attack and release)

Between the three, I always manage to get something I'm happy with.


JLE

P.S.- Duh.... looked again and noticed the OP is on a Mac, so so much for VST plugins, but I'll leave this as my own little monument to inattention, and in case it's usable information for other people.

[Fulcrum]

Duh.... looked again and noticed the OP is on a Mac,

Oo. That could lead to heartbreak if he tries Tapeworm, which is Windows only. Mea culpa.

[malice]

Worth every penny.

I prefer it to the real thing (most times).

at least you don't have to repair the tapes or put them back.

They pretty much have all the available tapes, including the custom ones. Pretty amazing job they did.

malice

[otek]

They pretty much have all the available tapes, including the custom ones.

Including Rick Wakeman's "Messiah" tapes? :D :lol:






(for those of you who went "huh"?.... check this out, ca 2.50 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W69rdh0dD44))

[Comte de St Germain]

at least you don't have to repair the tapes or put them back.

They pretty much have all the available tapes, including the custom ones. Pretty amazing job they did.

malice

Yeah, just turning on a mellotron makes me wince. I do love the way they sound however. I've found that although they tried to get the original style ambience on the sounds that a little of the UAD-1 reflection engine gets you what you need.

[eagan]

Something a little funny came up when I was buying the copy of M-Tron at the local instrument and gear emporium.

The salesman I was dealing with, a young guy (maybe early twenties) was enthused about having somebody there to buy that. Big fan of the Mellotron, apparently, and anybody who showed interest in anything about it was an immediate "brother".

What I thought was funny was when he said something to the effect that if I had a real Mellotron I would give to him, he would happily buy the plugin for me.

Now, obviously, on one hand this is a little silly considering the kind of "collectors item" market and prices you might see for an actual good working Mellotron, versus the $100 USD the software thing would cost, including the pile of sounds. At the same time, though, if I DID have an actual Mellotron, I would happily be rid of the fucking beast to go ahead and get the software version.

Never mind nostalgia. There is certainly an amazing charm in the sounds of the Mellotron, in all its versions, but let's be real. The actual devices are not things I would want to deal with. Just let me have those sounds to work with, playable from a keyboard that actually works reliably.


JLE

[dnafe]

Another thank you Fulcrum...just bought the bundle $5.00 who can go wrong at that price.

Don

[Fulcrum]

For the record, I don't know the fellow or fellows behind Tweakbench, so I gain nothing from pimping Tapeworm.

That said, I hope their stuff serves you well Don. Some, if not most of their plugs, are quite interesting.

On to Eagan's comments.. I saw on the Genesis fora where (in the gear forum) the punters were halfway to praying that Tony Banks would break his old Mk II out and take it with him on the reunion tour. 'Cos, you know, if he uses software, it just doesn't have the same vibe. Or some shit like that.

That concept is probably more asinine than even you or I can imagine, and I let everybody there know that. By the time the signal has gone through FOH and been bouncing around every wall, pylon, and empty seat of your friendly neighborhood hockey arena, the kids aren't going to know the difference between the "real" Mellotron and the not-real-but-an-incredible-simulation binary version.

[5down1up]

i never heard the plug bit i really do enjoy this one :
http://www.propeller-island-musik.de/sounds/dt/m400.rom.html

one of the GOOD sounding sample cds.

[otek]

Just let me have those sounds to work with, playable from a keyboard that actually works reliably.

Eagan, be careful what you ask for......

Your wish may be granted. (http://www.mellotron.com/mkvi.htm) :D

[eagan]

.. I saw on the Genesis fora where (in the gear forum) the punters were halfway to praying that Tony Banks would break his old Mk II out and take it with him on the reunion tour. 'Cos, you know, if he uses software, it just doesn't have the same vibe. Or some shit like that.

That concept is probably more asinine than even you or I can imagine, and I let everybody there know that. .....

Oh my god. There's no "probably" about it... asinine in the extreme.

It sounds like a great demonstration of how web "fan forums" can bring out plenty of dipshits with more typing time than clues available. Morons. I say put them, one at a time, in a closed room with Tony Banks' keyboard tech for the tour, with a good stout steel pipe in his hand, and let them run that idea by him.


JLE

P.S.- Back with a quick afterthought. As a pretty dedicated past fan of the earlier years of Genesis, I always thought that for most of the time, he used an M400, anyway?

Not that this really matters on the point at hand, just a trivia item.

[Fulcrum]

As near as I am able to determine from a casual poke around the Genesis fora (I feel... dirty), he used that and a Mk II at various stages of the band's early history. After 1978-9, he opted to use other means to get his string sounds.

Reviewing my comments to the group there, I guess I wasn't as harsh as I thought I had been...

Someone above said that by the time the sound has gone through FOH, by and large the punters wouldn't be able to tell the difference between the original and the sample library anyway.

That said, if you were TB, why would you subject yourself and your keyboard techs to the sheer aggravation of hauling one of those white elephants around creation?

Sometimes the best thing for a Mellotron enthusiast to do with his toy is to just leave it home.

It wouldn't surprise me to find he was going to be using something on the order of M-Tron. Why reinvent the wheel?

[otek]

That said, if you were TB, why would you subject yourself and your keyboard techs to the sheer aggravation of hauling one of those white elephants around creation?



We should make a thread about The Evil That Men Do (To Roadies) in order to get their sound.

Like Emmo and his gigantic modular.

Or Chick Corea and his Yammie C3 midi grand. :lol:

[Fulcrum]

Or Lyle Mays and his MIDI Steinway, for that matter. In that case (along with the ones Otek cites) I'm glad they go to the trouble.

On the other hand there's Geoff Downes' ostentatious early- to mid-80s rig when he was with Asia. Now, that was overkill and he'd better have been paying the roadies handsomely. Fairlight, Hammond, whatever grand piano he was trundling around the world....

I was actually gonna say that if you've got 1800 Euros burning a hole in your pocket, you could have one of these: a Memotron (http://www.manikin-electronic.com/en/index.html). But buyer beware, you may turn blue.

[eagan]

Hey. Look at that. This is the first I've even heard of the memotron.

I have to admit, for somebody who really has a hankering for the original in it's appearance and the physical layout, but not for the electromechanical nightmare and all that, that thing could have some charm.


JLE

[eagan]

Somebody at the BBC must be reading this forum.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/aod/networks/radio4/aod.shtml?radio4/sampledelica


JLE

[mrufino1]

If you have Reason the Sonic Refill, Mello-T, is great. It's only $30 as a download from propellorheads site.

[Slipperman]

Oh my god. There's no "probably" about it... asinine in the extreme.

It sounds like a great demonstration of how web "fan forums" can bring out plenty of dipshits with more typing time than clues available. Morons. I say put them, one at a time, in a closed room with Tony Banks' keyboard tech for the tour, with a good stout steel pipe in his hand, and let them run that idea by him.


JLE

P.S.- Back with a quick afterthought. As a pretty dedicated past fan of the earlier years of Genesis, I always thought that for most of the time, he used an M400, anyway?

Not that this really matters on the point at hand, just a trivia item.

Any of the 'old school classics', yes, even something from the Mellotron family, will cause a person to PLAY and therefore CREATE differently from any of the 'sampled' recreations.

Anybody who underestimates the importance of this in the long game has missed a VERY, VERY, important and powerful concept.

These things(everything from the Wurlie 200 to the Matrix 12) were INSTRUMENTS in their own right. You developed CHOPS on each one as a separate and REAL process/journey.

YOU CANNOT PLAY/FEEL the Hohner Clavinet on ANYTHING SHORT of the real fucking article. Which of the half DOZEN different REAL CLAVINETS would you like to START with?

Same for the whole Hammond family.

Shit. Something as simple as "WHERE THE FUCKING CONTROLS WERE LOCATED AND HOW THEY WORKED/FELT" would make you address the various instruments in a myriad different ways. I can think of an almost endless procession of examples off the top of my head.

Forget the GIGANTIC approach differences from Brand to Brand.

Just look at MODEL TO MODEL.

A Mini vs. a Micro or Multi.
A MicroKorg vs. a K2.
A Prophet 5 vs. a Prophet 10.
A Chroma vs. a Polaris.
A Matrix 6 vs. a Matrix-12.
An ARP2500 vs. 2600.

It's ENDLESS.

TACTILE COMMAND.

What is REQUIRED and WHAT IS DEVELOPED.

M-Tron my ass.

Had that software when it was about six seconds outta beta.

About as inspiring as jamming a Roto-tiller up my shit chute.

Gimmie Birotron #007... I'll crush that plastic shit in 60 seconds as I struggle with, and OVERPOWER a bizarre and totally freaky old box that about 30 people on the face of God's green earth have had the privilege of leaning on.

IT AIN'T JUST WHAT THEY SOUND LIKE.

It's what they MAKE YA DO..

Banging on the same fucking keyboard controller as you scroll between 6 zillion sampled sounds, reduces the beauty, fun, challenge, and MOST OF ALL.... creativity of the system by about 9000%.

Anybody whose not seeing this can snark my fucking hose on national TV.

MIDI and even programmable synths FUCKED UP and DESTROYED most of the best shit about the 'golden age' of electronic keyboards. Bunch of underachieving PUSSIES.

LIVE PANEL SYNTHESIS WAS A FUCKING ART FORM.

You had to know WHAT THE FUCK YOU WERE DOING.

You had to know the FUCKING INSTRUMENT and make it your bitch.

LMFBO but DEAD SERIOUS.

KILL.

KILL YA ALL.

MOOG SYSTEM 55 MOTHERFUCKERS!!!
POLY-FUSION!!!

If the keyboards don't take at least 3 hours to get set-up... you're a fucking COMPUTER NERD... not a keyboardist.

If the keyboardist doesn't have at least a HALF A TON of gear... he's either BROKE, JUST GOT ROBBED, OR A FUCKING MIDI PUSSY.

SM.

[malice]

HEHEHEHE


POST OF THE DAY MOTHERFOCKERS

:D

malice

[Comte de St Germain]

HEHEHEHE


POST OF THE DAY MOTHERFOCKERS

:D

malice

C'mon guys, telling people that real women are better than plastic ones is not doing "us" any good. Shut the fuck up or the Mysteries of the Emerald Tablet of Hermes will fall into the wrong hands (and they'll actually use their hands).

Novel fucking idea, tactile instruments are.

[decobred]

I agree with Slipperman, although I think he forgot to take his pills. I have a real Mellotron (the new MK VI) and have also had the M-tron software up and running to hear them back to back. The M-tron sounds ok, but it has a strange nasty underlying noise to it, which I suppose is meant to be tape noise? That being said, when my buddy first got that software, I played it for about 5 minutes and had my fill. When I sit in front of the real one, I can play the same three note melody with descending bassline for hours and not get bored. I think this translates to any instrument. I feel more inspired playing one of my older guitars than I do a shiny new one. Does that work for engineers and producers? Do you feel more inspired behind an old neve console than in front of a Digi Pro Control? Either way, for what you're looking for AJ the m-tron will probably be fine.

[malice]

Actually,

I find the M-tron real cool

But you gotta love Slipperman's post :D

Plus he's making great points, as usual

malice

[HOOK]

Thank You! SlipperMan for reminding me what synthesisis (No Z !!!:Razz: ) is all about; Playing an instrument with a soul and caracter of its own!!! ...synthesising is not about mimicing other sounds!! If you want a horn section; Use a fucking horn section!
But if you want something special...by all means...use a synthesiser!!

Thank you! Thank you! Thank you! :D :D :D


I played my EX-1 tonight!! ...like somone said; You can play just two notes on a real instrument for a loooooong time without being bored.....


....I do use pluggsynths/instruments, and enjoy them, but I find that they benefit from breathing some real air before ending up on tape....



....and yes! the number of synthesisers that you need is larger than the number of underwear you need....:Roll eyes: :Wink: :Wink: ...my wife does not agree, though....:Cry:



HOOK

[Slipperman]

Actually,

I find the M-tron real cool

But you gotta love Slipperman's post :D

Plus he's making great points, as usual

malice

Sad and shitty fact is:

I use the M-Tron(or another of it's contemporaries) more often than not.

That's because nobody's(supposedly) got the TIME to do the REAL DEAL these days.

Plus. Nobody can PLAY the 'real' instruments anymore(much less OWN them), so ya gotta deal with THAT angle as well.

I learned to LIVE with it YEARS ago... doesn't make me like it any more.

If ya wanna just plain 'get' to Melbourne from Tasmania..., ya take a plane or ride the fucking ferry.

Ya wanna LIVE/DIE A LITTLE and aren't a chickenshit loomer...?

That's when ya rent a fucking sailboat and pit yerself against the Bass straight.

Morons gargling ginger ale on the plane are NEVER gonna get the reason you'd do this...

Ever.





That's why they're on the fucking plane.










Fuck 'em.







HOHOHO.







XOXOXO

Slippy

[Calvin]

Slippy at his finest. Hilarious and insightful at the same time. :Coolio:

[Comte de St Germain]

The sailboat is definately a yard easier than the bus.

Then again I only eat fish I kill.

Unless i'm forced to "go out" for some sort of arranged carnivorous meet-up, "go out" for Ahi means 115 miles ESE from the sea Buoy.

The Mini, Odyssey, SH-101, Source, Rhodes, Wurlis, B-3 and pump organs are a short ride to the sound for spanish mackeral but the Ahi, seared in sesame oil and seeds is all about the "go out."

Sometimes, as you say, it is sometimes not worth leaving the dock, especially with no bait and bananas on board.

[otek]

Unless i'm forced to "go out" for some sort of arranged carnivorous meet-up, "go out" for Ahi means 115 miles ESE from the sea Buoy.


You just had to mention fishing.

*sigh*

I suppose a 115 mile trip would have me gripping the proverbial porcelain a few times too many though. Oh well.

[Comte de St Germain]

You just had to mention fishing.

*sigh*

I suppose a 115 mile trip would have me gripping the proverbial porcelain a few times too many though. Oh well.

At least you've been to the Sea Buoy.

And had fresh caught Mahi Mahi.

Changing tapes or running 115 miles? I'll take the run.

[Dion Stewart]

Sad and shitty fact is:

I use the M-Tron(or another of it's contemporaries) more often than not.

That's because nobody's(supposedly) got the TIME to do the REAL DEAL these days.

Plus. Nobody can PLAY the 'real' instruments anymore(much less OWN them), so ya gotta deal with THAT angle as well.

I'll point out one exception...

Ever seen MMW live? John Medeski lugs around a Mellotron on tour. And you're right, there's no way anyone could do what he does with it using a soft synth. He'll stick his hand inside the thing and muck around with the tape speed while he's playing.

And he's got a real Clavinet, Hammond organ, and a real piano on stage with him. As far as I know, all his keyboards are analog and you won't see a MIDI cable in his entire rig.


Dion

[2012]

The best way to describe software syhths is a monster with Reaktor as it's head and the MTRON as it's ass!
http://womb.mixerman.net/images/smilies/icon_twisted.gif

[vocalnick]

Sad and shitty fact is:
If ya wanna just plain 'get' to Melbourne from Tasmania..., ya take a plane or ride the fucking ferry.

Ya wanna LIVE/DIE A LITTLE and aren't a chickenshit loomer...?

That's when ya rent a fucking sailboat and pit yerself against the Bass straight.

Morons gargling ginger ale on the plane are NEVER gonna get the reason you'd do this...

I dunno... we pretty much only get the budget carriers in Tasmania these days, so you actually have to pay extra for ginger ale. That's pretty hard-core.