Production ideas and critique.

[ckerian]

Background: I am producing a CD for a young lady that has a manager that is connected (he was the drummer of a decent 80's metal/rock band) and this will be shopped. So he is financing this and let's just say i am within budget. We havent actually done much or rather we have gotten a lot done in what has seemed like little studio time.

We did all of this over Christmas Break.

So... now that dust is settling and I am making that preliminary evaluation on the "what the hell do I do now" and i am think I really dont like any of it. I thought it was going to be golden but here i am disappointed. Will drums make THAT big of a difference? Admitidly i havent so much as tweaked an EQ and compress and only in that arranging, editing, and chopping up phase but it's safe to say now that I dont think i can be pleased with what it is at this point. I have a saying around here and I am sure everywhere else it's echoed off the parallel walls of mediocre home studios everywhere...

"It is what it is."

Ideas? thoughts? suggestions?



http://www.crystalclearrecording.com/music/misc/midnightInMontgomery.mp3
http://www.crystalclearrecording.com/music/misc/loveYourMemory.mp3
http://www.crystalclearrecording.com/music/misc/Ride.mp3
http://www.crystalclearrecording.com/music/misc/BurninMoonlight.mp3
http://www.crystalclearrecording.com/music/misc/PutMyHeartToRest.mp3

[seagate]

"The page cannot be found" on all the links...

:(

[ckerian]

Thanks Seagate. I fixed the links.

[Bob Olhsson]

Backing tracks can severely limit vocal performances as can songs, tempos and keys.

Since you now KNOW your singer can do better, I'd look hard at recutting the tunes or even some better tunes. I'd probably talk this over with the manager to get his take on how to handle the situation.

[Mixerman]

First of all, they are demos. The kind of demos I expect as a producer. They demonstrate two things. She's a good singer, and she has good songs. The timing on the band leaves a bit to be desired. The arrangements are probably a bit busy at times, particularly on "Put my Heart to Rest." Everyone is riffing the entire song. You need to do some serious underdubbing on that song.

The most important thing you can do as the "producer" of these demos, is let her shine. That means you need to mix the arrangements in a manner that allows the listener to concentrate on the vocal and the song. Anyone who is in the business will recognize that these are homebrew demos. No one will wonder whether they can put the record out "as is." The goal is to get someone interested in taking her to the next step. In this case, I would say to get a "Producer" on board, someone with some juice and the ability to put together a band and put together a big league arrangement and track for this girl.

It's possible a label might show some interest from this, but the problem is she will then need to form a band in order to showcase. Well, if the goal is to get a label interested, and she ultimately will need a band to perform for the label, why isn't she forming the band now? That's a rhetorical question on my part because the answer to it lies with the manager. But it might be something you ask for your own edification. And the information might give you a better inkling of what you are expected to deliver. Ultimately, it is best for you to understand clearly the goal of this demo in order to complete the job to your client's satisfaction.

The fact is, you have put together a makeshift overdub band, and have included your own musical services in the effort. It doesn't sound like any of these players are "A list," and therefore you can only do the best you can with what you have available. Your salvation is in the fact that this is a demo of HER talents, not the makeshift band's talents.

At this point, you (and now we) have listened to your faders up mixes (a static mix in which every channel is open so as to evaluate the arrangement or lack thereof that exists naturally on the pallette). Based on this you have determined that you're not happy. I contend that you're premature with this determination. At this point you need to make some rough mixes. In these mixes, you need to ruthlessly edit and arrange what instruments come in where, by manipulating all of the raw tracks. I call this process "underdubbing." Whereas "overdubbing" is the process of adding to the production, "underdubbing" is the process of removing from the production. In this case, you may be using a combination of underdubbing and editing to construct your arrangements. Doing this will help reveal what you need to add (if anything), what is usable, what works with what, and what is unusable, thus allowing you to form an arrangement that makes sense to you. If you're confused, you need to put yourself in a position where you are no longer confused.

Whatever you do, don't go to the REAL mix process wondering if you have everything you need. Determine that now, and on your own. Then bring everyone in to listen to your roughs and talk about what needs to be done before completing the project. Those talks COULD include the idea that some songs should be retracked, some songs need to be removed from the demo, some songs can be sung better, some songs need different instrumentation, some songs need additional instruments, or any other variety of seemingly distasteful prospects given the time invested to this point. OR, it is quite possible you could have solved all of your problems and determined you're ready for mix. I have no way of predicting this because that's between you, the manager, and the artist.

The bottom line is this: if you're confused, or if you're feeling badly about the work, then you have to do take the time to investigate this. The short-term goal being to know and understand whether those feelings of negativity are founded or unfounded; the mid-term goal being to eradicate these feelings of negativity; the long-term goal being the delivery of a product that meets your clients objectives.

Mixerman

[ckerian]

That's a lot to chew on, thank you.

Yes, you are right, I have not started to "underdub' yet. I have a feeling it'll be mostly steel and some fiddle coming in n out but I have more faith in the leads then i do the rythem. Fortunetly, the tempos are OK and we tracked to a click.

This is a long term project for the manager. The talent is a state away from here in school and the manager is in alabama. The manager insists she finish school and not even worry about putting together a band yet. We tossed the idea about a show case this spring break with me putting together a band (which i actually could do with musicians we used to record)but it's a collosal failure waiting to happen and I am shying away from it. This giuy does seem to have her best interests in mind and even puts money where his mouth is and for that they deserve the best.

man, I just listened to "put my heart to rest" and when we first paid it down it to me was the hit. It's a fricking train wreck. the backup/doubling needs to go.

I'll keep you guys posted on these and put up versions as i do em.

[Cosmic Pig]

Every tune is different so I only listened to Midnight in Montgomery so far.

I'm no expert but I will be one day so there's no need to take me too serious... yet.

Definitely some pitch and timing issues with her vox. Also her performance is bland. Didn't believe it like. What I would do is get her to over exagerate the parts. All intimate up close and sexy for the verses, then big for the chorus. See if she'll get some crackle in her voice for the quiet stuff, like that thing that Jewel and Kenny Rogers built careers on. She can do it, I just didn't hear enough of it.

Some bg's might help too. I see the potential you saw, although with this song the melody is a common one.

It may be the vocal timing that makes me think so, but it drags bad. The attachment I added is a piece I threw in Wavelab and time stretched it shorter from 107 bpm to 110. I think it grooves a little better with her vocal performance. You could do it slower like that but she needs to really work that sucker at that tempo and I'm not sure she has the chops for it.

I think you're on the right track with instrumentation, give the ethereal feeling okay... but maybe think along the lines of Chris Isaak's Wicked Game.

One last thing, the beat sorta humps along rather than traveling. Maybe try simplifying the bass line or change the kick pattern?

That's all I can think of off the top of my head for that tune.

Cos.

[ckerian]

You're right Cosmic, it does flow a lot better at that tempo. I wish we had more time to track while she was in town. If she makes her way back down here we'll certainly do more.

Right now theres three or four things need done... edit the leads, fix and retrack guitars, re-track drums. the vocals i think I can put together a convincing track, i have a few alt playlists for everything.

[ckerian]

Updates on...

http://www.crystalclearrecording.com/music/misc/PutMyHeartToRest.mp3
http://www.crystalclearrecording.com/music/misc/burninMoonlight.mp3
http://www.crystalclearrecording.com/music/misc/LoveYourMemory.mp3
http://www.crystalclearrecording.com/music/misc/Ride.mp3