Thread: Drummer's perspective

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  1. #1
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    Default Drummer's perspective

    I was listening to one of the radio thingies the other day, can't remember which one but I think it was Slipperman who got into talking about drummer's perspective.

    Basically because I was a lousy drummer and I couldn't impose myself as such on whatever it was the band was doing - although I still definitely blame the bassplayer for that - I tend to take revenge in my mixes and allow the drummer to be the center of the universe : Drummer's perspective.

    Opinions ?

    Chris
  2. #2
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    Default Re: Drummer's perspective

    I prefer the drummer's perspective, too. Hi-hats on the right bugs me so much that sometimes I'll switch my headphones around when I'm listening to certain music. I think with the way most drums are panned/mixed it's unrealistic as an audience perspective. If you're in the audience, the hats aren't going to sound like they're 30ft to the right of you and the ride 30ft to the left, unless of course it's stretch armstrong drumming. I have to imagine it's still drummer's perspective, but it's a left handed kit for it to make sense.
  3. #3
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    Default Re: Drummer's perspective

    Well I'm one of those people making annoying audience perspective recordings. I agree its unrealistic the way we often pan hi-hats...but as that recent post on hi-hat micing suggests...maybe most of the time we dont need the hh mic anyway!
    I dont see how having the hh on the left rather tan the right can be annoying. It doesnt annoy me when its on the left.
    I suppose its all a matter of taste...other peoples choice of panning can prob be annoying on all instruments if as a professional it is not to your taste.
    I was under the impression that US was hh left and UK hh right generally...not sure if thats true.
  4. #4
    Quantum Psychic Passed out in public restroom
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    Default Re: Drummer's perspective

    I think you listen a lot differently if you play, or have once played the drums with any regularity.
  5. #5
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    Default Re: Drummer's perspective

    I was under the impression that US was hh left and UK hh right generally...not sure if thats true.

    Well...the US is Left Hand Drive, and the UK is Right Hand Drive...so if the drummers visited each other's country, neither will know which side of the road is for tailgating...and which side is for head-on collisions.




    Does that help?




    Cheers,
    Tim
    Don't forget, we are all engaged in a battle to the death against mediocrity.

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    Weedy ignores this simple bit of glaring obviousness because he is an "ELECTRIC BASS GUITARIST"(coughcough)
    and views the kick drum as a "bass riff rhythmic pattern suggestion generator" - Slipperman
  6. #6
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    Default Re: Drummer's perspective

    I think you listen a lot differently if you play, or have once played the drums with any regularity.
    I love playing..although I'm lousy due to lack of learning. When a kit is set up in the booth I often stay late to attack my ears.
    I'm a lefty though and have tried hh on both sides.
    I guess if you play a lot then it prob bugs you more.
    Does it bug you when you are up close to a band at a gig...prob not cos the drums are not hard panned.

    Well...the US is Left Hand Drive, and the UK is Right Hand Drive...so if the drummers visited each other's country, neither will know which side of the road is for tailgating...and which side is for head-on collisions.


    Thats really helpful Tim
  7. #7
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    Default Re: Drummer's perspective

    I think it's a matter of habit. Of course, the drummer's perspective thing will be thrown off instantly when you mix a southpaw.

    I just like my hihat to the left. Can't really say why.

    Whether we choose to mic the hat or not is irrelevant, so long as we're using stereo overheads the hihat will end up somewhat to either side..... unless we try and center it by way of mic placement (which will likely put the kick and snare in very weird places).


    otek
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  8. #8
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    Default Re: Drummer's perspective

    I dont see how having the hh on the left rather tan the right can be annoying. It doesnt annoy me when its on the left.
    I suppose its all a matter of taste...other peoples choice of panning can prob be annoying on all instruments if as a professional it is not to your taste.
    yeah...i agree. who the fuck really cares. i figure if you're mixing a live record and want to acurately paint the picture, than this is the only time it matters. That said, if you want to make the drummer the center of the universe, go for it.

    i'll sometimes put the whole drum set on one side. fuck it. it's music. Sometime's it's nice to live in a fantasy world.
  9. #9
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    Default Re: Drummer's perspective

    Have you guys found that people's being left-handed or right-handed influences their panning preferences? Maybe it's a subconscious, instinctual sort of thing where you're more comfortable with certain sounds on a certain side of you, like if you have to fight it you can square up more easily...

    Admittedly, I have a skewed perception of the stereo image because one of my ears sticks out more than the other.
  10. #10
    Once did Lady Di on a bet Broke like Joe Thiesman's leg
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    Default Re: Drummer's perspective

    Is it the left ear or the right ear??
  11. #11
    Once did Lady Di on a bet Happy Roman... Gladiator
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    Default Re: Drummer's perspective

    It doesn't matter; there's no room or drumkit in the universe that sounds like a close miked set. A true drummer's perspective would put the kick and toms off slightly to the right (for a traditional setup).

    Throw in a freaky setup like mine and all bets are off anyway.
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  12. #12
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    Default Re: Drummer's perspective

    I always do audience perspective.

    and, for the record (no pun), nothing says you HAVE to pan or assign things into superwide 'unnatural' positions in EITHER perspective.
    So I don't get the HH argument.

    Recently I made a record with a left handed drummer and had a real existential dilemna trying to decide whether to do true audience perspective, knowing that to most listeners it would appear as just a right handed drummer's perspective!

    Ultimately I stayed true to my principles and did audience perspective.
    Meaning it's reversed, but still as you look at the front of the kit.
    Last edited by weedywet; March 9th, 2007 at 08:09 PM.
  13. #13
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    Default Re: Drummer's perspective

    I do audience perspective.

    But when the drummer ask me for a cdr, I discretly swap left and right to avoid silly discussions.

    malice
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  14. #14
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    Default Re: Drummer's perspective

    Ultimately. it doesn't matter. I figure half the world has their hi-fi wired backward anyway.

    But I was taught drummer's perspective, so that's what sounds right to me. I justify by saying hi to lo tom fills go left to right, like reading. Maybe if I were Israeli, I would do it the other way.
  15. #15
    The Real Mixerman Spend years studying Twisted Sister's chord structure
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    Default Re: Drummer's perspective

    Depends on what's in there to balance the mix, but I seem to pan most instruments from the musicians perspective. I sorta like to "be" the musician when I'm diving into the mix, especially when I'm editing.

    If anyone has a problem with that, it's not like flipping L-R is hard to do these days
  16. #16
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    Default Re: Drummer's perspective

    I do audience perspective for left handed drummers. And drummer perspective for right handed drummers.

    Call me crazy.

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  17. #17
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    Default Re: Drummer's perspective

    Every time I've heard a drumkit in a room, it's been basically mono.

    I thought most of you guys were part of the "it's an instrument, not a collection of instruments" movement.

    You don't see people micing each string of the guitar and panning them hard left to right?

    So I do drummer's perspective, so I don't have to air-drum lefthanded.
    Gearwire.com Drum Mixing Tutorial: The best way of course is an oscilloscope... but, we don't have that, we don't have that here, so we have to use our ears...
  18. #18
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    Default Re: Drummer's perspective

    Drummer's perspective. Air tom fills!

    (And I actually also have the funny thing of having a HF dip in my right ear; I like to keep the Hh better in check by having it mostly somewhere between L and C... Thoguh with this logic I should mix a ride- heavy tune with audience perspective? Nah... :P )
    *BLeep*
  19. #19
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    Default Re: Drummer's perspective

    I don't understand how folks can get so worked up about this
  20. #20
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    Default Re: Drummer's perspective

    If anyone has a problem with that, it's not like flipping L-R is hard to do these days
    Interesting. Cause I can't stand listening to my mixes if L-R is swapped. Just sounds different.
    Vedat

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