Thread: The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

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  1. #1
    Frustrated Chick Rock singer...now doing jazz standards poorly! Drummer with a girlfriend...has home!
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    Default The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

    https://www.kickstarter.com/projects...iscovers-music

    Whether or not the company and its player take off, I hope it raises public awareness of the sorry state of the average listener's experience. If it does well, maybe Apple and others will at least TRY to make better-sounding players.
  2. #2
    Most friends are "on the inside". Oxygen bandit
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    Default Re: The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

    Well, the project has already exceeded its funding goal; so it will exist, if only among the few thousand people who have put money down.

    The artist support in the video featured on the site is certainly impressive too. Ol' Neil certainly has some friends willing to stick their neck out.

    I really hope the product is as impressive as they say it is.
  3. #3
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    Default Re: The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

    While wandering around some techy sites yesterday I ran across articles about the Pono and the comments were scary stupid. The gist of most was that there was no difference between an MP3 and a 24/192 flac. It was just a plot to make people buy music. (hopefully)

    What was worse is that they would get a gazillion likes for their comments and the person who made a reasonable comment got zip zero nada.
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  4. #4
    Little River Band on The Run Internet Meme
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    Default Re: The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

    Why try to help idiots get good sound experience? Sounds like fucking for virginity to me. Let them have it and let people who honor great quality have it too.

    Life is too short and precious to waste on saving people from themselves. Teaching them about cause and effect is one thing - but engaging in a discourse over people's right to justice stealing by disregarding differences in sound quality is plainly silly.

    Everybody's got a right to suck and to like suck! They usually gather up in flocks. Be in or be out. Choice.

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  5. #5
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    Default Re: The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

    While wandering around some techy sites yesterday I ran across articles about the Pono and the comments were scary stupid. The gist of most was that there was no difference between an MP3 and a 24/192 flac. It was just a plot to make people buy music. (hopefully)

    What was worse is that they would get a gazillion likes for their comments and the person who made a reasonable comment got zip zero nada.
    to the extent that there's little difference listening to an mp3 vs. a full-monty-data format on Dr. Dre boomSplat earbuds while jogging on a treadmill in a large gymnasium full of clanking and whirring background noises, or while sitting on a city bus...they're perfectly within their rights to notice that you CAN'T notice the difference in those environments.

    But of course, that's not what we're talking about.

    The scary thing is the rise of the me-centric universe. It's always been with us, but it's getting much stronger. The me-centric universe is the place where the entire CONCEPT OF REALITY revolves around me, at it's centre.

    if I don't notice a difference, then there IS NO DIFFERENCE. If I don't use a feature, then that feature is NOT USEFUL. If I don't like some-her, then that person is NOT LIKABLE.

    It keeps going. It infects the politics, right down to the very core concepts of physics. If I don't believe something, it's therefore NOT BELIEVABLE.

    This mindset is wildly amplified by the internet. Because after all everything is money-driven, then instead of finding uncomfortable or contradictory information on the internet, the search algorithms and marketing algorithms show me things that comfort me: They reinforce my worldview and encapsulate me in a bubble. This would be ok enough, if we actually understood that it was happening. But the "promise" of the internet is that it gives you the entire world, while the delivery on that promise is actually the world as we expect it.

    This is not some kind of conspiracy or deliberate thing. It just happens because "that's the way the frog boils."

    The loomers who write the "mp3 is no worse than FLAC" comments are expressing those me-centric thoughts as general (and accepted-settled) fact, because they tend more and more to not experience contradictory stimulus, throughout their entire world, not just in the narrow realm of their audio experience.

    The internet automatically connects them with others who "like" their ideas, actively crowding out others who would contradict their ideas. The notion that "5,973 people LIKE my comment" is an intoxicating elixir.
    "...but ma, audio engineering IS gainful employment!..."

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  6. #6
    Little River Band on The Run Internet Meme
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    Default Re: The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

    The internet automatically connects them with others who "like" their ideas, actively crowding out others who would contradict their ideas. The notion that "5,973 people LIKE my comment" is an intoxicating elixir.
    That.

    Beware when people like you. It does not automatically mean you're good. It may as well mean they suck too.
  7. #7
    wardrobe malfunction investigator "Mock Chicken" joke?...could be American.
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    Default Re: The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

    The internet automatically connects them with others who "like" their ideas, actively crowding out others who would contradict their ideas. The notion that "5,973 people LIKE my comment" is an intoxicating elixir.
    Tried doing a search for housing benefit help the other day, first few pages were just daily mail articles condemning people.
    Shoulda saved that for my therapist
  8. #8
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    Default Re: The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

    to the extent that there's little difference listening to an mp3 vs. a full-monty-data format on Dr. Dre boomSplat earbuds while jogging on a treadmill in a large gymnasium full of clanking and whirring background noises, or while sitting on a city bus...they're perfectly within their rights to notice that you CAN'T notice the difference in those environments.

    But of course, that's not what we're talking about.

    The scary thing is the rise of the me-centric universe. It's always been with us, but it's getting much stronger. The me-centric universe is the place where the entire CONCEPT OF REALITY revolves around me, at it's centre.

    if I don't notice a difference, then there IS NO DIFFERENCE. If I don't use a feature, then that feature is NOT USEFUL. If I don't like some-her, then that person is NOT LIKABLE.

    It keeps going. It infects the politics, right down to the very core concepts of physics. If I don't believe something, it's therefore NOT BELIEVABLE.

    This mindset is wildly amplified by the internet. Because after all everything is money-driven, then instead of finding uncomfortable or contradictory information on the internet, the search algorithms and marketing algorithms show me things that comfort me: They reinforce my worldview and encapsulate me in a bubble. This would be ok enough, if we actually understood that it was happening. But the "promise" of the internet is that it gives you the entire world, while the delivery on that promise is actually the world as we expect it.

    This is not some kind of conspiracy or deliberate thing. It just happens because "that's the way the frog boils."

    The loomers who write the "mp3 is no worse than FLAC" comments are expressing those me-centric thoughts as general (and accepted-settled) fact, because they tend more and more to not experience contradictory stimulus, throughout their entire world, not just in the narrow realm of their audio experience.

    The internet automatically connects them with others who "like" their ideas, actively crowding out others who would contradict their ideas. The notion that "5,973 people LIKE my comment" is an intoxicating elixir.
    The thing I worry about with this is that people who would otherwise be interested in the product might be discouraged from buying it now. They might even be convinced they will not hear a difference so they can't hear a difference.

    I think it's pretty cool. I would love a high quality digital playback device just for listening in the living room or the studio, but the file format thing is a double edged sword for me. I'm totally into having the best quality possible, but it means files have to be encoded properly and there's obviously going to some re-purchasing.

    The fact that they have already reached their goal is really really promising.
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  9. #9
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    Default Re: The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

    If it catches on enough to matter, Apple will squash it like a bug by including the same features in the iPhone 6/iTunes. But if it comes to that, Neil will still have accomplished his mission, as I assume he is not motivated by money here.
  10. #10
    Joan River's boytoy FBI Agent searching hard-drives
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    Clown Re: The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

    Part of the 'features' is 'sit down, shut up, and listen like you were a vinyl junkie'. It's a whole other way of engaging with digital audio, right down to the 'Toblerone' form factor that is just small enough to not be waste-space for the sake of selling to the wealthy, small enough to be easy to transport, but cannot be used whilst jogging.

    One thing about it is, I don't think Apple's gonna give up on their 'little white headphones accompanying every non-listening thing you do' marketing angle. Their product CAN be used like a Pono, but they are not going to try to reposition it that way.

    It's a very interesting time to be a musician, engineer, or gearmaker that likes old school sonics. I am almost bet-money-on-it sure that a primary distinguishing factor between Pono and what's out there is, the Pono stuff will be mastered with totally unlimited peak energy, and will come out tens of dB lower than anything on the market today. It'll be so much less loud that it will seem out of place played on an iPod in traffic or on the subway, even if the iPod ends up able to handle the file.

    But of course that's part of the idea. It IS out of place, doing critical listening while jogging or on the subway. People stopped sitting down to just listen. Neil no likey that reality and is changing it through design and marketing.
  11. #11
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    Default Re: The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

    Good points - didn't think of it exactly that way.
  12. #12
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    Default Re: The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

    ... I am almost bet-money-on-it sure that a primary distinguishing factor between Pono and what's out there is, the Pono stuff will be mastered with totally unlimited peak energy, and will come out tens of dB lower than anything on the market today. ...
    I'm not so sure. This is one of the parts that hasn't been clarified by the Pono folks yet. Are we going to get remastered, uncrushed music or are we going to get the same stuff that HDTunes etc have? Granted, in the FAQs they say that delivery will be in whatever depth and bitrate the original masters were, rather than (for example) 16/44.1 upsampled to 24/96 to attract a price premium as all too often occurs. But I still don't see hundreds / thousands of albums being remastered for Pono. I hope I'm wrong...
  13. #13
    Frustrated Chick Rock singer...now doing jazz standards poorly! Confused by Rosie O's attraction to Tom Cruise
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    Default Re: The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

    I'd guess that there's some sort of replay gain, ...but if not, the difference between a rock song like "Toys In The Attic" with no brick wall limiting with peaks close to full scale compared to something that's balls out is something in the range of a 6 to 8 dB difference.

    Even if Pono doesn't succeed, ..the David and Goliath thing and maybe the buzz Pono is creating is exactly what's needed to push iTunes to up their game anyway. The trajectory is right, so kudos to Neil Young for trying.
  14. #14
    Most friends are "on the inside". Oxygen bandit
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    Default Re: The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

    Television manufacturers spend untold amounts of money on ads, during the initial switch to flat/hi-definition screens, to let us know the previous technology of their product was unbearably dated. To be seen with one of those bulky, box-like televisions was almost embarrassing...déclassé.

    Until someone starts doing that with hi-definition music technology, they're never going to get anywhere in the mainstream market.

    You literally need a commercial with some hip, relevant music star walking past some poor, socially-compromised individual listening to shrill mp3s on earbuds. Rock star then glares in disgust and says, "Pfft, that's how you listen to music...?" before putting on quality headphones, rolling his eyes, and walking off. The music then changes from low-bandwidth and shrill to full-definition and pleasing.

    *End Scene*

    There. I just changed the music industry.
  15. #15
    Frustrated Chick Rock singer...now doing jazz standards poorly! Confused by Rosie O's attraction to Tom Cruise
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    Default Re: The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

    With $3 mil already reached of the $800,000 goal and 32 more days to go, it looks like they'll have some money to spend on promo.
  16. #16
    Astrological sign is "Feces"! Prefers rhythm cowbell to lead
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    Default Re: The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

    High quality music starts at the source. I don't care what delivery method you chose to pipe "Wrecking Ball" into my headphones, it still tastes like a shit sandwich.
    Last edited by volthause; March 14th, 2014 at 08:42 PM.
    ...in the lowest tenth percentile.
  17. #17
    Frustrated Chick Rock singer...now doing jazz standards poorly! Drummer with a girlfriend...has home!
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    Default Re: The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

    I don't care what delivery method you chose to pipe "Wrecking Ball" into my headphones, it's still tastes like a shit sandwich.
    Miley or Emmylou with Neil?
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    Default Re: The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

    some people will always prefer McDonald's.
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  19. #19
    Astrological sign is "Feces"! Prefers rhythm cowbell to lead
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    Default Re: The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

    Miley or Emmylou with Neil?
    The former.
    ...in the lowest tenth percentile.
  20. #20
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    Default Re: The Pono Kickstarter is taking off

    Why would you even want that in your headphones?

    Although I must say that the Ron Jeremy video was pretty funny.
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