1. #1
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    Sushi And while I'm on the subject of things l like about LPX

    There's one feature that I have come to really, really appreciate in Logic Pro X: Alternatives

    I know that there was always a way to do this in the past, but it is so much easier to manage in LPX.

    If anything, I've come to appreciate it these days as I have been busting my balls on a couple of drum mixes only to come to the realization that a 70's kit recorded with modern equipment will never yield the 70's sound I'm after. I was able to set up a few alternatives with different libraries and different mix settings in a snap. If anything, it made things much easier to find the mix I wanted.

    If anything, I think I've made more use of Alternatives in the past few weeks than in the past 10 years. Some things are better off easy.

    jord
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    Default Re: And while I'm on the subject of things l like about LPX

    Yup.
    Mike
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    Default Re: And while I'm on the subject of things l like about LPX

    If we're talking live drums, I always found that moderate recording levels, fewer mics and no compression gets me a lot closer to a "70s" sound (even though that term is almost impossibly broad).

    If we're talking a library, the biggest problem is almost always the anachronism itself (and the ever-present problem of realistic programming). Unless said library was very meticulously made for that purpose.

    Ken Scott's 70s libraries come to mind (e.g. Bowie/Supertramp).


    otek
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    Default Re: And while I'm on the subject of things l like about LPX

    Re: Supertramp....

    I was soldering my 2bus LT into the patchbay (finally) and was listening to "Crime of the Century". Very dry. The snare just jumped out at me at one point. I thought that was the only mic he must've had active, lol. But it was very loud in the mix, so it must've just been drowning out the other mics. Overheads or tom mics. I guess maybe gates on the other mics?

    Anyways, great drum sound!
    Mike
  5. #5
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    Sushi Re: And while I'm on the subject of things l like about LPX

    I probably way oversimplified things as far as 70's drum sound thang.

    The library is just one part of it. If the beats, playing style along with the rest of the music doesn't match, it won't sound 70's even if they were recorded using an EMI REDD 37 unit with old mics.

    Not to mention that the Ken Scott libraries are but one style. I'll admit that I love the Andy Johns style (I'll admit to having used his libraries in many arrangements).

    I will admit that I have grown very partial to Native Instruments Abbey Road Drummer series, and for me, half the fun in Logic is setting up alternative mixes with the different libraries and flipping back and forth to see which ones I like best in the song. There are some times where a 70's library doesn't cut it, but a 60's library does and I enjoy playing with the possibilities at times.

    jord
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    Default Re: And while I'm on the subject of things l like about LPX

    I've been using the Alternatives thing a lot lately.

    Very handy!

    I've got that NI Abbey Road library. I'll have to take it for a spin again!
    Mike
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    Sushi Re: And while I'm on the subject of things l like about LPX

    I've been taking all of my NI drum libraries and creating drummer maps for them. It's a PITA, as far as the NI libraries go, but it was well worth it in the end. For one song of my own that I've been working on, I was jamming with "Ian" playing the Abbey Road 60's late kit and admittedly I was hooked. It got even better once I told the drummer track to follow the music. You'd almost think that the computer had feelings.

    I think it's plain to see that the Drummer feature in Logic is another one of my faves. It's something I can just have "play" while I am noodling on the guitar, bass or keyboard and it doesn't feel like a computer (at least to me). Perhaps, it's my tweaking on the grid that helps. It's probably been well known, but I discovered that I can substitute any VI in place of Logic's drum kits on the drummer track, and I don't need to create alias tracks if I don't want. I sort of discovered this when I was taking my car in for some service (I take my laptop to keep me amused) and decided to see if I could replace the drums with something like Ultrabeat. To me, this was good because I can experiment with things like Battery and even some synths. It could get interesting, especially after I took advantage of Native Instruments Komplete Ultimate special. Mind you, I haven't tried it in a multi-out, but I probably will soon enough.

    jord
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    Default Re: And while I'm on the subject of things l like about LPX

    So you're just remapping the midi notes to align with Drummer? Now that's pretty cool!

    That should be doable with Superior drummer too!

    Is there a way to do it with the drum mapping tool in the Environment? That might be easier?
    Mike
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    Default Re: And while I'm on the subject of things l like about LPX

    This is probably the one time I wouldn't want to use the Environment. I'd rather be making all of my third party libraries conform to Drummer, seeing as that is the common element. This way, I can dial in new beats, fills and arrangements and everything is good to go by simply loading the library and changing the map.

    I'm probably just being the grumpy ol' man here, considering that I only had to do it once for each library. After that, it is load and go.

    I already made drummer maps for BFD3 (they included a couple of them with the release) and they have served me well already. I'm just finding for a lot of the stuff I'm writing these days, I finding there's something about the Abbey Road libraries playing with the drummer rhythms and fills.

    jord
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    Default Re: And while I'm on the subject of things l like about LPX

    This is probably the one time I wouldn't want to use the Environment. I'd rather be making all of my third party libraries conform to Drummer, seeing as that is the common element. This way, I can dial in new beats, fills and arrangements and everything is good to go by simply loading the library and changing the map.

    I'm probably just being the grumpy ol' man here, considering that I only had to do it once for each library. After that, it is load and go.

    I already made drummer maps for BFD3 (they included a couple of them with the release) and they have served me well already. I'm just finding for a lot of the stuff I'm writing these days, I finding there's something about the Abbey Road libraries playing with the drummer rhythms and fills.

    jord
    That's awesome! I'll have to play around with it! Thanks!

    Mike
    Mike
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    Default Re: And while I'm on the subject of things l like about LPX

    One problem I find (although I almost never program drums, but it's equally applicable to any sample library) is that the general velocity sensitivity and feel is different among most of them.

    Swapping one piano sound for another, often means you have to completely redesign the velocity mapping to make it sound right. One "patch" may sound better than another simply for the fact that it responds better to the dynamics of the performance.


    otek
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  12. #12
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    Default Re: And while I'm on the subject of things l like about LPX

    I agree that they are different. And, at the same time, I would that this is also a case where one has to be aware of the musical goals they are after and know the libraries that they are using and how they will affect the music. The drum libraries (or any library for that matter) are not simply about the sound, but about the feel as well.

    Using the NI Abbey Road libraries as an example again, the 60's Drummer library has a totally different sound and feel than the 70's library. Dare I say, the 60's library is more of a "rounded and perhaps a little boomy" sound and feel, and the 70's library seems more punchy, direct and in your face. In some cases big and roomy and in other cases dry and direct. There were a lot of tasteful entities that made up the 70's. The fun part of making these discoveries was when I paired them up with one of Logic's "drummers"... let's call him "Ian".

    As part of an experiment in songwriting, I wondered what would happen if I let Ian simply follow either my guitar or bass part and didn't manually edit his MIDI parts, although I did direct him via the grid and the various knobs, including fill, swing and push. After getting the rhythm to where I felt it was right using the sound and feel of Logic's own kit (Ian used a Manchester kit, just for reference), I then created four alternative tracks, one for each aspect of NI's 60's and 70's libraries. Without changing the velocity levels, I sensed a real difference in the music with each set of drums, not just by how they sounded, but by how the rhythms interacted and felt with the drums. It was almost as if Ian had multiple personalities, and yet Ian's playing didn't change. The 60's library gave Ian more of a Blood, Sweat and Tears type of style where the 70's almost gave Ian a more Zeppelin-ish style.

    If anything, I probably would have gotten a greater variance by subbing in the 80's or Modern Drummer libraries without changing the beat. Mind you, that might have turned out to be an experiment of either what I didn't want the song to feel like or what would Ian sound like now, since those decades brought totally different sounds and feels.

    jord
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