Thread: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique

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  1. #21
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    Default Re: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique

    I notice that the room mic is quite high, do you always set it like that, or do you sometimes place it closer to the floor?

    usually lower.

    in the audio clips it's about 4 feet off the floor
  2. #22
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    Default Re: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique

    What really kills me about the sound clips is how defined the toms are in the stereo spectrum, and how solid the low end is.

    The 84 sounds like it's on the verge of folding, though. Are you getting some overs on that, or is it just the snare itself that is sort of "clamped down"?


    otek
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  3. #23
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    Default Re: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique

    I don't know if it's just me, but it seems as though there has been a trend towards snare drums that sound subdued on the high end, almost as if the snare is turned off. It's just a general feeling I get.

    Compared to older recordings.


    Old school:

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  4. #24
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    Default Re: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique

    What really kills me about the sound clips is how defined the toms are in the stereo spectrum, and how solid the low end is.

    The 84 sounds like it's on the verge of folding, though. Are you getting some overs on that, or is it just the snare itself that is sort of "clamped down"?


    otek

    it can sound sort of like that, but in truth that's mostly that drummer's sound and snare tuning

    I mostly prefer that more snare-y sound that Nobby is also describing, but it's not for everything or every drummer.
    a LOT of that is older school drummers didn't hit the rim so relentlessly.

    check this out (about :50 secs is a good spot) to see how he studiously avoids the rim

    young drummers just rarely play like this anymore.

  5. #25
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    Default Re: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique

    skoo snare.wav

    here's just the snare 84 from another part of the session
    just FYI

    and from a completely different session, different drummer, room, etc.
    just snare.wav
  6. #26
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    Default Re: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique

    The "tunnel" is usually done with packing blankets or similar, supported by for example mic stands, chairs, or even a drum shell. The idea of the tunnel is most often to isolate an "outside" kick mic from cymbal leakage or room reflectivity. Sometimes, this mic is placed several feet from the kick drum - depending on the tuning and size of the drum, low frequencies may need a little distance to fully develop.

    What you are referring to is more like a "resonator" drum, typically a larger kick with one very thin head, tuned in such a way as to create a low, "singing" sustain on the kick (and in part, by nature of how transmission works, on the whole kit).


    otek
    Thanks for clearing that out for me Otek. I've never used a second drum, but apparently have been using a tunnel a "tun" of times without knowing, that was the term 😎

    When I want a "singing" kick sound, I usually use an old 26" marching drum

    https://fbcdn-profile-a.akamaihd.net...69863c5cdaba18
    Last edited by Bjerre; May 2nd, 2015 at 10:19 AM.
  7. #27
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    Default Re: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique

    not really,
    only if there are a ton of cymbals set up, in which case I probably come in closer to the drum
    Ok, thanks.
  8. #28
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    Default Re: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique

    Just listened to the clips. Suitable for framing in every sense. Will likely refer to them before every drum session I do in perpetuity. Sticky this thread?
  9. #29
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    Default Re: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique

    Sticky please!

    I've been doing drums this way 90% of the time. Although I do like stereo room if I available.

    What do you do if you want more boom from the toms? I've been eq'ing the kit mics, per side, for more tone/body. Doesn't seem to affect the cymbals/rest of the kit much.

    Its certainly a complete sound that works in most situations! Very clean!
    Mike
  10. #30
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    Default Re: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique

    certainly you can (and I often do) add some bottom to the L-R mics in the mix.
    those tracks are "raw" as they were recorded... that doesn't imply I don' eq them as needed in the mix

    Like most British balance engineers (and by contrast to what I saw when I first came to American studios) I'm not a purist... I eq quite a lot sometimes, if it's necessary.
  11. #31
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    Default Re: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique

    What do you do if you want more boom from the toms?
    As WW said, you can always add a bit of low end shelf, but seriously, the toms in the clip have a seriously solid and defined low end - adding bottom in that particular case would be excessive, to my ears. I am a bit surprised that that is the flat sound. Typically when I do this thing I tend to get a lot more of a "splatty" midrange particularly from the floor toms, but then I don't usually have good 87s on hand.

    Addendum: using super-cardioids in this case can be helpful if you find you get too much of the cymbals.

    Addendum #2: WW, I listened to the snare clip. There indeed does not seem to be any overt clipping, but to my ears, the snare sounds a bit "choked" - presumably from damping, and/or possibly from the snares being too tight.


    otek
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  12. #32
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    Default Re: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique

    As WW said, you can always add a bit of low end shelf, but seriously, the toms in the clip have a seriously solid and defined low end - adding bottom in that particular case would be excessive, to my ears. I am a bit surprised that that is the flat sound. Typically when I do this thing I tend to get a lot more of a "splatty" midrange particularly from the floor toms, but then I don't usually have good 87s on hand.

    Addendum: using super-cardioids in this case can be helpful if you find you get too much of the cymbals.

    Addendum #2: WW, I listened to the snare clip. There indeed does not seem to be any overt clipping, but to my ears, the snare sounds a bit "choked" - presumably from damping, and/or possibly from the snares being too tight.


    otek
    Yes, my tom recordings are typically the same as yours with a more prominent mid range. As of late I've been using the Lucas CS-1s for this duty, and it's much better, but I'm thinking tuning, the actual drum, etc...is more likely the issue. I haven't felt the need to add a bunch.
    Mike
  13. #33
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    Default Re: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique

    certainly you can (and I often do) add some bottom to the L-R mics in the mix.
    those tracks are "raw" as they were recorded... that doesn't imply I don' eq them as needed in the mix

    Like most British balance engineers (and by contrast to what I saw when I first came to American studios) I'm not a purist... I eq quite a lot sometimes, if it's necessary.
    Cool, thanks!
    Mike
  14. #34
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    Default Re: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique

    Thanks WW!!
  15. #35
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    Default Re: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique


    Addendum #2: WW, I listened to the snare clip. There indeed does not seem to be any overt clipping, but to my ears, the snare sounds a bit "choked" - presumably from damping, and/or possibly from the snares being too tight.


    otek

    Yes.
    It's not my favourite either, but it's kind of the way he plays.
    He hits the rim much MORE than he actually hits the drum!
    and it's tuned very tight as well.

    it's somewhat less so in the clip marked Just Snare, I think
  16. #36
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    Default Re: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique

    it's somewhat less so in the clip marked Just Snare, I think
    Now that's a snare sound I like.

    A lot less damped, and consequently a more generous thump in the low end. Lots of attack too, I can tell you're using a condenser.

    I mixed a track today with this one.

    SnareOfToday.wav

    Beyer 201 with a little console EQ. Mine sounds like it's under a blanket compared to yours.

    EDIT: I was listening to the "SkooSnare".


    otek
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  17. #37
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    Default Re: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique

    Hitting the rim at the same time as the head is called powerstroke. And it sounds great and loud when your in the drummers listening position. But it really sucks out a lot of body and lows (200 cycles) when close mic'ed. It also cuts down on the time of the drums natural resonans.


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  18. #38
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    Default Re: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique

    Hitting the rim at the same time as the head is called powerstroke.
    Actually, it's called rimjob, erm, rim-shot.
    Powerstroke is a pre-dampened head by remo usa.
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    Default Re: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique

    Actually, it's called rimjob, erm, rim-shot.
    Powerstroke is a pre-dampened head by remo usa.
    Ok, my bad. It seems that what I would call rim-shot (like in "Rim-shot baby" by Erykah Badu) is also known as "cross stick" or "rim click".
    I've also been asked to do a "power stroke" where "rim job" (by your definition) was meant.

    I just gathered, that Remo took the name for their head from drummer-lingo...

    It must have been lost in translation from English to Danish.
  20. #40
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    Default Re: The weedywet 4-5 mic drum technique

    I've also been asked to do a "power stroke" where "rim job" (by your definition) was meant.
    If this is intentional humor, Bjerre, you're a genius!

    (if not, I apologize for laughing.)


    otek
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